Women and Reclining

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As we tell the Exodus story during the seder, we teach about our freedom not only verbally — through reciting the text of the Haggadah — but also actively, including reclining at key places. Women, who are obligated in the various aspects of the seder, do not recline in many Ashkenazic communities. Why would they refrain from this, alone among the obligations of the evening?

I. Women’s Leniency

We discussed earlier (link) that the Talmud exempts women from reclining except “important” women who are either independent or free from household chores. According to Tosafos, all women in their day — and certainly today — are “important”. Yet, they still do not recline in many communities, and as codified by the Rema in Shulchan Arukh (Orach Chaim 472:4). Is this not a violation of the Talmudic ruling that “important” women must recline?

Rema bases the leniency for women on the Ra’avya’s ruling that reclining today is not a sign of freedom. In Mishnaic times, the wealthy elite reclined while eating. However, times have changed and reclining no longer demonstrates freedom. Yet, why do women rely on this Ra’avya and not men? Either all should lean or none. Why the gender distinction?

II. Two Aspects of Reclining

R. Mordechai Willig (Am Mordekhai, Seder Mo’ed 29:3) quotes an explanation of this widespread, codified practice which posits that there are two aspects to reclining. The Midrash (Shemos Rabbah 20:19) notes the ambiguous language of Exodus 12:13. What is normally translated as “But God led the people about” can also be translated as “And God caused the nation to recline.” By reclining during the seder, we are commemorating this aspect of the Exodus story. Reclining is a remembrance of the miracle (zekher la-nes).

On the other hand, reclining is also a publicization of the miracle (pirsum ha-nes). By acting like free people, we are demonstrating to the world that we were taken out of Egypt. If God had not taken the Jews out of Egypt, we and our fathers and our fathers’ fathers would still be slaves and would be unable to recline at the seder.

III. Reclining Today

While authorities disagreed which of these two reasons — commemorating or publicizing the miracle — obligate us to recline, we act strictly and follow both. However, according to the second reason (pirsum ha-nes), reclining only serves to publicize the miracle if free people today recline. Since they do not, we need not recline. According to the first reason, however, reclining still fulfills the function of commemorating the miracle.

Women’s obligation in the commandments of the night come from the reason of “Af hein hayu be-oso ha-nes – they too were part of the same miracle.” R. Joseph B. Soloveitchik explains that this reason only applies to mitzvos that publicize a miracle, such as reading the megillah and lighting Chanukah candles, but not mitzvos that commemorate a miracle, such as sitting in a sukkah.

Therefore, it stands to reason that women are only obligated to recline because of the second reason (pirsum ha-nes) while men are obligated because of both. Since leaning only has meaning today according to the first reason (zekher la-nes) and not the second, men must lean but women need not.

(Reposted from two years ago)

About Gil Student

Rabbi Gil Student is the Publisher and Editor-in-Chief of TorahMusings.com, a leading website on Orthodox Jewish scholarly subjects, and the Book Editor of the Orthodox Union’s Jewish Action magazine. He writes a popular column on issues of Jewish law and thought featured in newspapers and magazines, including The Jewish Link, The Jewish Echo and The Vues. In the past, he has served as the President of the small Jewish publisher Yashar Books and as the Managing Editor of OU Press. Rabbi Student serves on the Executive Committee of the Rabbinical Council of America and as Director of the Halacha Commission of the Rabbinical Alliance of America. He also serves on the Editorial Boards of Jewish Action magazine, the Journal of Halacha and Contemporary Society and the Achieve Journal of Behavioral Health, Religion & Community, as well as the Board of OU Press. He has published five English books, the most recent titled Search Engine volume 2: Finding Meaning in Jewish Texts -- Jewish Leadership, and served as the American editor for Morasha Kehillat Yaakov: Essays in Honour of Chief Rabbi Lord Jonathan Sacks.

45 comments

  1. As with others of my age cohort, our mothers were too busy keeping themselves awake rather than succumb to their exhaustion to worry about the technical details of their degree of incline.

    Question in all seriousness: given the modern day textual methodology (cf. horseradish vs. lettuce), why not recover the true method of eating and reclining discussed in the Mishnah? It can be easily and affordably replicated in this day and age.

  2. why not recover the true method of eating and reclining discussed in the Mishnah? It can be easily and affordably replicated in this day and age

    Because (a) no one does it, even at state dinners before really important people and (b) it is not at all easy to do for the uninitiated and (c) buying all those couches for one night a year would be quite expensive.

    But please, why don’t you do that at your home and report on how it worked out.

  3. On a more serious note, R. Soloveichik had a really good eitzah: turn your chair sideways so you lean on its back. Works real well, especially if you add a pillow or two.

  4. even at state dinners before really important people

    Of course, in modern Western society they wouldn’t recline — and certainly wouldn’t sit in a chair the way you describe — at state dinners before really important people.

  5. People recline because acc. to most authorities (other than the Raavyah), that is still a halakhic requirement. You fulfill that with ease by doing what R. Soloveichik said to do. No requirement to go “whole hog.” The gemara says one person can lean on another.

    Doing more than that as you suggest would accomplish nothing halakhically, nor would it lend any importance to the Seder. So that is why people don’t do it.

  6. So when does mimesis trump textuality? E.g. why not apply the same analysis to the use of horseradish for maror?

  7. What do you mean? I only use horseradish for maror.

  8. “So when does mimesis trump textuality?”

    It seems to me that what you are suggesting is neither, but rather reconstruction.

  9. Avraham Etzion

    The rav suggests that a slave stands all the time-has no time to eat.Also a soldier stands at attention-Standing thus is a sort of infrigement of freedom.I would add the jews in the camps who stood on line and rushed to receive food
    Sitting down and reclining is to be relaxed-a sign of freedom
    Therefore it seems to me that today all women should be required to incline!

  10. It is far from clear that women’s obligation in the mitzvot of the Seder is from “Af hen hayu b’oto hanes”. Certainly the obligation to eat matzah is not–the gemara is quite explicit that that comes from the tie between the aseh of eating matzah and the lav of not eating chametz. The gemara is explicit only about the 4 cups coming from that reason. The exact reach of “af hen” is a major machloket Rishonim; the most likely (i.e. the one that makes most sense to me) outcome is that it applies to rabbinic enactments for pirsumei nisa. so to the extent heseba is pirsumei nisa, maybe.

  11. In this connection I will note that there seems to be some glorification in frum media (eg kids books, newspapers/ads) of the role of the wife/mother “serving” at the seder, or at any seudas mitzvah. “Our” women may be “important” but they/we tend not to have domestic servants with the frequency of women in tosafist times. Is that relevant?

  12. I don’t understand the basis of the rationale offered by Rav Willig in the name of RYBS on the heseibah of women, or lack thereof. In addition to the argument advanced by Mike S. on a specific torah requirement for both men and women to eat matzoh at the seder – independent of any consideration of pirsum nes, the exemption of women from dwelling in a succah is specifically derived from the talmud’s diyuk of ‘ha-ezrach’ – independent of commemoration. I would also consider that the talmudic requirement to drink 4 kosot is not based on pirsum nes but, rather, commemoration of the geulah. The requirement of magid appears to be based on the idea of pirsum nes, yet women have traditionally not lead or actively participated in magid.

  13. The requirement of magid appears to be based on the idea of pirsum nes, yet women have traditionally not lead or actively participated in magid.

    Huh? Maggid is an independent mitzvah, in which women are obligated. My impression is that the custom was that they do at least the minimum (Rabban Gamliel omer). In SA it is brought down that the story should be explained to them.

  14. The only reason my wife would be leaning at the seder is that she is dead tired 🙂

  15. Therefore it seems to me that today all women should be required to incline!

    Most poskim say otherwise – see RSZA on the RABMAM (that women don’t lean due to “eimas baalah”) and on the RAN and ROSH. However, it might be that widows or divorcess (r”l) might be obligated to do so.

  16. “Several authorities offer different reasons to excuse women from heseiba; interestingly, these reasons do not assert that women are incapable of experiencing cherut through heseiba. For example, the Or Zarua cites an opinion which exempts women since reclining would be disrespectful to their husbands. A woman would have been obligated if not for the ‘insult’ to her husband; concerned with this slight, Chazal never extend the obligation of heseiba to women. Other opinions (see Rabbeinu Manoach in his commentary to the Rambam) exclude her since she is busy supplying the meal.
    It seems that her exclusion is based upon some more important value superseding the mitzva, rather than suspending heseiba in the absence of cherut. The fact that the gemara demands heseiba from an isha chashuva – a notable woman – merely reinforces the uncertainty. Is she an exception because she is capable of sensing cherut, which is a precondition for an obligation of heseiba? Or is she included within the heseiba experience because her demeanor will not insult her husband? ‘

    http://www.vbm-torah.org/pesach/pes67mt.htm

  17. It seems to me that what you are suggesting is neither, but rather reconstruction

    Yirmiahu — that would be the case if we were discussing a matter without halachic import, but the premise of this post is that reclining is a halachic act (textually rooted in the Mishnah, just like what constitutes Maror).

    Maggid is an independent mitzvah, in which women are obligated. … In SA it is brought down that the story should be explained to them. [the women]

    Tal — So, perhaps that is the reason why “women have traditionally not lead or actively participated in magid”.

    [And, of course, since historical context is irrelevant to halacha, that is what we continue to do :-)]

  18. Ruvie’s addition amplifies the issue Tal raised from the SA. Most women were viewed as incapable (e.g. “the story should be explained to them. [the women]”. The exception being the Isha Chashuva who is capable.

    Doesn’t this align with the idea that all women today can be classified as Isha Chashuva and hence they too should be obligated to recline, if the men are?

  19. Hoffa: “Most poskim say otherwise – see RSZA on the RABMAM (that women don’t lean due to “eimas baalah”) and on the RAN and ROSH. However, it might be that widows or divorcess (r”l) might be obligated to do so.”

    Is it relevant whether “eimas baalah” reflects any current reality? (ie, whether women are actually afraid of or intimidated by their husbands, and whether someone who is intimidated would not engage in ritual reclining out of that fear?) Is this yet another phrase that has a simple meaning, but which we are going to treat as a mere “technical term”?

  20. Not sure. I didn’t see the psak from RSZA inside. Its funny though that somebody asked, after hearing this, what does a husband do if he has a scary wife? 🙂

  21. IH-“Yirmiahu — that would be the case if we were discussing a matter without halachic import, but the premise of this post is that reclining is a halachic act (textually rooted in the Mishnah, just like what constitutes Maror).”

    Perhaps if there were some feature or ambiguity in the text which raised a question of whether its requirements are being met, but without basis to suggest that the text isn’t satisfied by what is actually contained in the text it seems to me that you are simply dealing with reconstructing non-essential details rather than “mimeses” or “textuality”.

  22. Yirmiahu — As you know, the mishna simply states אפילו עני שבישראל, לא יאכל עד שיסב. I could easily understand that we interpret that broadly that the Seder is meant to be as luxurious as one can afford on a stretch. But, if we’re going to be particular about it — ritualisticaly defining hasava: what it is and who does it — then I think my question is reasonable to ask those who, for example, make a big deal about lettuce and not horeseradish because that is what the Mishna says.

    And to be clear, my real target here is the lettuce/horseradish debate, which I am framing in another example where it could be applied.

  23. The question about whether or not women are obligated in heseibah tangentially involves a broader question about the language and content of the 4 questions asked by the younger members of the family. It seems that we’re stuck with outdated formulations that we carry on in a purely ritualistic manner. The 1st question assumes that the child ordinarily sees the family eating chametz or matzoh, where only matzoh is at the table at the seder. Typically, however, matzoh is not served at family meals during the year. It should then be more accurate to ask why we eat chametz during the year, but only matzoh at the seder (and during Pesach). The 2nd question suffers from the fact that lettuce is served throughout the year (even horseradish), while the seder features both lettuce (horseradish) and another green such as celery or parsley. The 3rd question assumes that the child never sees dipping during meals throughout the year, whereas dipping is actually not uncommon. Moreover the child has not yet seen any dipping at the time the question is asked. Of course, the child may well remember what was done in the previous year, or else he can be coached prior to starting the seder – assuming that there is time to spare before everything is ready. Finally, the question about leaning assumes that leaning also occurs during the year, whereas the child never sees leaning except at the seder. Furthermore, the language of ‘kulanu mesubin’ has the connotation that everyone leans. This post, however, deals with the question of whether the females at the seder lean or not. The practice has been that they don’t. Try explaining that to a child.

  24. “Furthermore, the language of ‘kulanu mesubin’ has the connotation that everyone leans. This post, however, deals with the question of whether the females at the seder lean or not. The practice has been that they don’t. Try explaining that to a child.”

    I wonder about this from the school perspective. I learned that “we” lean at the seder in kindergarten, first, second, third etc. grades. In communities where that “we” doesn’t include women, do they teach “men lean at the seder”?

  25. From Safrai’s Haggadah of the Sages, Carta, 2009. p.55

    In the Mishna, as we have seen, there was no question about reclining. In Eretz Israel during Mishnaic times they would recline at every festive meal, all year round. This custom (“hasava” in Hebrew) was unknown in Babylonia, and therefore the Babylonian sages spent a lot of time discussing which foods require reclining – whether only the matzah, or the wine and the maror as well – and whether it is required for all the cups of wine, and who is required to do so. These discussions indicate that reclining was not common in Babylonia, and that they continued to observe it because of the halacha in the mishna at the beginning of ch. 10 which states: “Even a poor person among the Jews will not eat until he reclines.” In none of the versions of the Eretz Israel Haggadah does the Ma Nishtana include the question: “but on this night we all recline,” but the Babylonian Haggadahs from the Geonic period include the question. It may be that this difference originates in Amoraitic times and in the difference in dining habits between Eretz Israel and Babylonia.

  26. And to be clear, my real target here is the lettuce/horseradish debate, which I am framing in another example where it could be applied.

    Maror nowadays is rabbinic. I do not see the possibility of custom overriding rabbinic law as a major source for worry. After all, according to many, “lo tasur” is the source of obligation for both rabbinic laws and customs.

  27. Avraham Etzion

    According to Rabbi Soloveitchick-Women are xbligated in all Mitzvoth of the Seder.THe Seder is based on recitation when
    placed before you are Matzo-Moror and Korbon Pesach.Women are obligated in these three Mitzvot as Matza is calledLechem Oni_Sheonim Aleham Devorim.Likewise Kol Shelo Omar Shlosho DEvorim Lo Yoitzo Yede Chovo-so that Sippur Yetziat Mitrayim is interconnected with these 3 things which form the basis of the Seder so that Hasaba is integral part of Achilat Matza and Korbon
    and need Hasava/Likewise Chayov Adam Lirot et atzmo (tu kleharot et Atzmo)Keeki hu yotzo mmitzrayim-this can not be done without reclining
    Rav Obadia Yosef likewise says it is absoluely clear that the Sippur Yetziat Mitrayim is incumbent on wimen.So says the Chinuch
    It is agreat Chiddush to say the converse
    Similarky on obligation of women for Seuda Shlishi-according to Ramban women are obligated in all Mitzvot of Shabbat-no need to
    bring in Sheaf hen hoyu beoto hanes

  28. “Question in all seriousness: given the modern day textual methodology (cf. horseradish vs. lettuce), why not recover the true method of eating and reclining discussed in the Mishnah? It can be easily and affordably replicated in this day and age.”

    We sit on floor pillows and other comfortable stuff like couches and relax.

    As for eating the meal that way, we don’t find it comfortable or really feasible. (I can’t imagine ever eating anything the way the picture attached to this article shows, I’ve tried while I’ve been sick in bed before, and it’s not pleasant)

  29. “Typically, however, matzoh is not served at family meals during the year. It should then be more accurate to ask why we eat chametz during the year, but only matzoh at the seder (and during Pesach). The 2nd question suffers from the fact that lettuce is served throughout the year (even horseradish), while the seder features both lettuce (horseradish) and another green such as celery or parsley. ”

    That would depend on where you live and what you consider matzah. There are many unleavend breads that people eat throughout the year.

    It also depends on what you use for maror, if it’s just romain lettuce, or actually something very bitter which you wouldn’t eat the rest of the year.

  30. Sorry to beat a dead horse, but i would be grateful if someone here could answer this empirical question for me: what do they teach about leaning in all-girls schools? (or coed yeshivish preschools?) elementary schools?

    I recently had the, err, opportunity to watch the uncle moishy video for “pesach we celebrate / with matza marror and a seder plate…” which I’m sure some of you know… In it there are several shots of a father and sons during magid – i.e., for that that portion they are ok to omit women. Then there is a mock seder with an “abba” (boy) who says kiddush and reads the hagaddah, an “ima” (girl) who wears a tichel and serves food, and two “kids.” When they sing “we eat the matza and we all recline” they _all_ recline. When they get home then they don’t?

  31. Y. Aharon:

    The answer to all your questions is that what is different is not that the child sees a variation from the year, but that we go out of our way to do things a certain way on the night of Pesach — that these are obligatory.

    Thus, on all other nights we eat chametz and matzah, means we can eat whatever we want — some like this, some like that. (And there are those who do eat matzoh during the year, because they like it, or because it is an easy way to do lechem mishneh). But this night we HAVE to eat matzoh — we go out of our way to do so.

    Same for maror, dipping and reclining. Rest of the year, it is a reshus, tonight it is a chovah.

    Otherwise, what does sh’ar yerakos even mean? There is no prohibition to eat maror (either romaine lettuce or horseradish) the rest of the year, nor for that matter is there any problem or issue with eating other vegetables during the seder meal. You could have a romaine lettuce salad with five other vegetables any night, including seder night, if you wanted to.

  32. Tal — yes, that is the secondary school answer; but, it’s not really satisfying. First, Ma Nishtana in the Mishna has no maror, no she’ar yerakot and no reclining. Second, in both versions (Mishna and ours) we say that we don’t dip during the year, even once — but, any child knows we do dip during the year.

  33. Emma: My daughter does not recall ever being taught about reclining or, for that matter, details about the happenings at the seder. It could be she’s just too old to remember what she learned in the early years of elementary school.

  34. IH:

    First of all, the question was asked about the girsa in the haggadah, which is what I was answering.

    Second, the Mishna as quoted in Pesachim 116a (and in the separate Mishnah) DOES mention maror/she’ar yearkos and dipping. It does not menion reclining, but instead mentions how meat is cooked — roasted as opposed to a year-round choice of cooked, boiled and roasted.

    Third, your statement that “any child knows we do dip during the year” is double flawed. First of all, who dips? Most people I know don’t. But second, so what? The rest of the year, dipping is optional, on seder night we are obligated to dip twice (for that matter, you could dip more times on seder night if you want to, and you could dip other nights if you want to).

    So nothing you have written refutes the point that the distinction being drawn is between obligation and option. If anything, the Mishnah’s version of roasted vs. cooked/boiled/roasted meat only reinforces the point. What if the child’s family happens to like roasted meat? Point is, the rest of the year, that is a matter of personal preference, this night it is an obligation.

  35. י,ד מזגו לו כוס שני, וכאן הבן שואל. אם אין דעת בבן–אביו מלמדו, מה נשתנה הלילה הזה מכל הלילות: שבכל הלילות, אין אנו מטבלין אפילו פעם אחת; והלילה הזה, שתי פעמים. שבכל הלילות, אנו אוכלין חמץ ומצה; והלילה הזה, כולו מצה. שבכל הלילות, אנו אוכלין בשר צלי שלוק ומבושל; והלילה הזה, כולו צלי. לפי דעתו של בן, אביו מלמדו. מתחיל בגנות, ומסיים בשבח; ודורש מ”ארמי אובד אבי” (דברים כו,ה), עד שהוא גומר את כל הפרשה.

    Ref: http://kodesh.snunit.k12.il/b/h/h23.htm

  36. דף קטז,א משנה מזגו לו כוס שני וכאן הבן שואל אביו ואם אין דעת בבן אביו מלמדו מה נשתנה הלילה הזה מכל הלילות שבכל הלילות אנו אוכלין חמץ ומצה הלילה הזה כולו מצה שבכל הלילות אנו אוכלין שאר ירקות הלילה הזה מרור שבכל הלילות אנו אוכלין בשר צלי שלוק ומבושל הלילה הזה כולו צלי שבכל הלילות אנו [מטבילין] פעם אחת הלילה הזה שתי פעמים ולפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו מתחיל בגנות ומסיים בשבח ודורש (דברים כו) מארמי אובד אבי עד שיגמור כל הפרשה כולה:

    http://www.mechon-mamre.org/b/l/l2310.htm

  37. Further to the quotation from Safrai above, this lower on the same page:

    However in the Haggadah from Geonic times, in most of the Geniza fragments, in the books of the early Poskim and in their Haggadahs, the question about roasted meat was deleted since it was not customary in Babylon, and two questions were added: (a) “That on the other nights we eat all kinds of vegetables, tonight maror”; (b) “That on all other nights we eat whether sitting or reclining.”

  38. The question about roasted meat refers specifically to the Beis Ha Mikdash, as the Rashbam there explains. (There is an opinion that even the korban chagigah on the night of Pesach has to be eaten Tszli miderabbanan. The korban Pesach, of course, must be made that way, as set forth in Parshas Bo.)

  39. As an aside, my facsimile copy of the Bomberg Venezia Masechet P’sachim, renders the dipping in the quotation from the Mishna slightly differently:

    שבכל הלילות אין אנו חייבין לטבל אפילו פעם אחת הלילה הזה שתי פעמים

  40. Tal — I’m too tired to look up the reference now, but it appears that eating Tszli continued in some communities long after Churban Bayit Sheni. It was not, however, done in Bavel — and that was probably when the linkage to Beit ha’Mikdash was made by way of retrospective explanation.

  41. IH — given that the Torah explicitly states that the korban Pesach must be Tzli Eish, and that the gemara says that the Mishnah follows the opinion that even the korban chagigah must be Tzli (on seder night, of course), then there clearly was a link to korbanos and the Beis ha Mikdash.

    Some communities did continue eating Tzli as a zecher le mikdash, some did not. Both customs are brought down in Shulchan Aruch, although by Ashkenazim, at least, the universal custom is NOT to eat roasted meat.

  42. As a public service, I scanned the Amud from the Bomberg which can be downloaded from: http://tinyurl.com/dx7y3b4

    Tal — Obviously, if that version of the text (שבכל הלילות אין אנו חייבין לטבל אפילו פעם אחת הלילה הזה שתי פעמים) were what we have today, then I would agree with your argument that “The rest of the year, dipping is optional, on seder night we are obligated to dip twice”. But, that is not the text we have.

  43. IH: I get that our version is different. Point is, our version can be read to mean, tonight we went out of our way to do things in a certain way, whereas on other nights we do whatever we want. You don’t have to read it that way, but it is a plausible reading, and it answers up the same issue Y. Aharon raised as to EVERY question in all the girsas, because in every one what happens on other nights is a pure choice — eat whatever you want, whatever way you want– whereas on Seder night you are being particular to do things a certain way.

    Dipping is a good example. Sure, some people dip sometimes at other meals, but they don’t make a whole ceremony out of it. They just dip into whatever they happen to have if they happen to want to do it. Seder night, we make a point of doing that.

  44. Rav Gil, I believe the verse for the post is 13:18 – not 12:13.

  45. The gemara in T.B. Pesachim 116a asks ‘chiyuv ledardekei?’, meaning what is the point of attempting a distinction between voluntary and obligated for little children. The question is asked with regard to one version of the dipping question and the ‘corrected’ version is the we use – but the idea can be taken more generally.

    More importantly, the nusach of the cited mishneh in Pesachim states, ‘shebechal haleilot uni oichlin basar zli, shaluk, umevushal; halayla hazeh kulo tzli’ (all other nights we eat roasted, stewed, and cooked meat; tonight we eat only roasted). The gemara explains that this stam mishneh is according to Ben Teimah who stated that the chagigah brought on the day of the korban Pesach has nearly all the dinim of the Pesach, including the manner of preparing. In other words, if the family brought a chagigah offering, it was consumed broiled just as the Pesach offering that they were about to eat. However, this is a minority view and is not easily reconciled with the verses in parshat Re’ei. There is a stam mishneh earlier in Pesachim (69b), that rules against Ben Teimah.

    The question is, why does the gemara in 70a state that the mishna in 116a is according to Ben Teima, when it has already ruled against him? Is there no other resolution to the nusach about roasted meat than the view of Ben Teima? Why not assume that the mishna refers to the nusach after the destruction of the temple, when there was no longer a korban Pesach, and the practice was to roast ordinary meat as a remembrance?

    It seems that IH and Tal are onto something about the evolution of contrary customs in eretz Yisrael and Bavel. In Israel, it appears that they specifically ate broiled meat as a remembrance of the korban Pesach, whereas in Bavel, they specifically did not eat roasted meat for fear that it might be considered a Pesach offering. A Bavli Amora, Rav Chisdah, is the one who advanced the thesis that the mishna in 116a reflected the nusach in times of the mikdash when, according to Ben Teima, only broiled meat was consumed. He may have been unaware of the custom in Israel to eat broiled meat zeicher lePesach. It would be of interest to learn what the Jerusalem talmud has to say about this mishna.

    Wishing everyone a ‘chag kasher vesamei’ach.

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